Mini-Documentary by Kurt Brungardt
(you may recognize a few faces and names in this video)
Accompanying article and additional information can be viewed by clicking (HERE)
Categories: Horse News, Wild Horses/Mustangs
Wild Horse Issue Gaining National Attention
Straight from the Horse's Heart 
Thank you for this – what better solution can be brought to the table – for all who worked to reach such an offer to the BLM, thank you and let’s hope Abbey will hold his promise to consider solutions that make sense… this surely does, it serves every purpose of the subject and a new partnership would start a new shift that is so much needed.
I pray this will come true.
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I have watched a number of these videos about OUR Wild Mustangs . Why is it okay for the BLM to think that we don’t have a say when OUR TAX DOLLARS PAY TO KEEP THEM FREE. WHAT GIVES THEM THE RIGHT TO THINK THAT WE HAVE TO PAY TAXES FOR THEM TO ABUSE OUR MUSTANGS . THEY HAVE CLEARLY BROKEN THE LAW AND IF IT WERE YOU OR I WE WOULD BE IN JAIL FOR THE THINGS THEY ARE GETTING AWAY WITH. I THINK WE SHOULD ALL JUST STOP PAYING TAXES TILL THEY LISTEN. IF WE PUT IT IN AN ESCROW ACCOUNT AND HOLD IT TILL THEY SHOW US WE HAVE A VOICE THEY CAN’T GET US FOR TAX EVASION AND THEY WON’T GET THE FUNDS TILL THEY SEE THEY HAVE TO ADHEAR TO OUR WANTS FOR OUR MUSTANGS.
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Excellent. Thanks for posting. Here’s a link to support/provide feedback for their feature film
http://www.wildhorsedoc.blogspot.com/
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Excellent production, though, not intending to be picky, taken by itself it is a little propagandish and self serving. Not saying their motives or proposal are bad – actually sounds really good. Seeing the horses again in those feed lots just breaks my heart.
Abbey was his usual self “bad forage” BS. Scary statement “ability of range to support the proposal” – yep, Sir, but then you need to get rid of them cattle! Scare right back at you, not that I’m important in any way, but I will work to the grave to rid the USA of welfare ranching, OR, you can just move the cattle off the wild horse portions. Other scary statement about “sound proposal” – so Pickens was not a sound proposal? WHY NOT? Come on Abbey, work with us a little bit! And Spriggs misspoke that current long term holding facilties are zoo like compounds. No one even knows where they are. Perhaps he was refering only to proposed Salazoos.
What do we know bout Neda De Meyo and Kundrna? I think we all agree with her that it is a “fixable” and agree with him, for “a lot less tax dollars”.
Last question, where is this area in relationship to Calico? Next door, overlap, how far away?
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If you think Neda trying to save the horses of Calico is self serving, you don’t know Neda.
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I said the documentary seemed a little self serving (meanig for the proponent Kundrna). I did not say that was a bad thing either. As long as something is good for the horses, I don’t really care why someone does it – good for them.
And, you are correct, I do not know her. Any input from those that do would be appreciated.
I am anxious to see everything come out good in the end.
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I am hoping and praying that something good, whether this proposal, the Mega complex, what MP proposes, or all, come to pass soon,
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This piece will reach more people who may not know about this issue, that in itself is a good thing!
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My question is could this turn into a Jason Meduna thing or that other guy in CA who “rescued” all of the Dann Sisters horses and then let them starve. What happens when Kudma dies? Or runs out of money?
BLM turned down Madeleine Picken’s proposal which would certainly have saved the taxpayers money even given that BLM would pay her a fee for each horse. I think if you add the numbers, her plan would definitely be cheaper than paying catoor and the
holding facilities etc etc.
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You should visit Return to Freedom sometime and see how she treats wild horses. Pretty amazing woman.
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I understaned the reference to Meduna. It is valid and sure it “could” happen. But, I think we know better this time. We are organizing through Herd Watch. Drug and gambling can ravish anything, for sure, guess we have to decide for ourselves how likely we think that is and what we think is best for the horses.
Anyone know how many Meduna like sites there are out there? Or is that some BLM secret?
Just one last thought – there have been plenty of rescues with good intentions that ended up in horder situations, as well as down right messes like Meduna, but we don’t think that is true of most of them. There are plenty of backyard and pupply mill breeders who operate horribly, but again, we don’t think most breeders are like that.
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I think her track record speaks for itself, she has developed a wonderful program and the next best thing to being wild. The one concern that I have-Is exactly what is happening to ISPMs program in N. Dakota..It runs out of funding and is facing having to get rid of those herds..Now in this case, the blm would be paying 375 a horse per year, but..apparently..and it is still not clear to me..these would remain as breeding herds??? What of all the stallions that will be gelded..what of the best of the calico stallions that have been sent to the palamino holding facilities to be auctioned off..you are culling off the very best of mare and stallion genetics and leaving the least strong genetics to reproduce..This is against what mother nature had already established and against all i know as a breeder.
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This also pertains to a topic that will be brought up in Denver..how to improve adoptions..You can throw all the money you want at this program in window dressing and training..but the most important aspect..is Quality..and that starts by leaving the superior genetics in the herd structure..Mother nature has allowed those individuals to rise to the top like cream..it is icing if they also have color for the adoptions..The calicos have improved the quality of their herd..on their own..the only species that is allowed to reproduce when they are stupid is mankind..in the wild they die..If we are going to thin the herds it has to be done not randomly..you throw your best fish back to raise generations of other big fish..In the long term it benifits the adoption program by raising the numbers of quality individuals.
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PS I don’t mean to sound like a cheer leader for this proposal, I think there is much more to find out. I want to think it will be a good thing.
For me it is weighing this against some BLM holding faciitly somewhere – where we also do not know the real fate of the horses. Short of turnig them al free and stopping this insanity form the git go, which remains our primary goal, perhaps we are chosing the lesser of 2 evils. Maybe for at least some horses that is the best we can do right now? I sure don’t know yet, maybe ever.
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Roxy, I agree, right now, if this gets some horses out of prison pens, and back on the range, can it be that awful??? I don’t know. however, Meduna was NOT a paid LTH contractor for BLM; he was running a “sanctuary” and was buying and adopting BLM mustangs and putting them on his ranch; and getting donations from other places to run his ranch. these people would be receiving a stipend from BLM for the care of these horses.
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When Madeleine Pickens proposed her plan it was just after that announcement by the BLM that golly gee, all they could do with all those horses in LTH was to euthanize them. She only wanted to take the horses that were already in LTH and put them out on land she would own in the West.
The BLM have hemmed and hawed and made excuses, but they have not let her have those horses and have never explained why.
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From what I’ve read, it’s the ‘yearly stipend’ for their care that’s one hold up. And the Bureau has some ‘rules & restrictions’ about the area around the ranch she wanted to put them on.
All of the above is subject to verification with the publication read & it’s political affiliation.
Here’s what I don’t get: If it was me, and I had a considerable amount of the world’s wealth at my disposal, I would ask for the Wild Ones in holding, move them to my land, allow the requisite year to pass before the titles were handed over to me, then tell the Powers That Be to Kiss My Wealthy Ass – these animals are now permanently MY GUESTS; you can take yer stipend, yer rules & regs and deposit them in the appropriate orifice, or words to that effect.
I can (sort of) understand the rancher asking for a stipend – he’s exchanging cattle for Wild Ones, so it’s not a totally philantrophic offer.
But I don’t understand why the Bureau would feel the need (in Mrs. Pickens’ case) to poke their nose in where it’s not needed, especially if that poke becomes a deal breaker.
Does the Bureau REALLY want equitable dispersal of the Captives in long term holding or NOT?
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MP’s original proposal, for which she was named ABC’s “world news tonite’s” person of the week back in 2008, was for her to take all these LTH horses and put them on her ranch, then her proposal became a bid to be a contractor, paid a yearly stipend as are other LTH facility owners. One of the holdups, as I remember, was that she wanted the stipend awarded “in Perpetuity” and the BLM does not award contracts forever.
I fI had that much money, I would not be asking for a yearly stipend per head. She explains on her website that the “economy” has hurt the plans for this sanctuary. Now she wants to have an equine tourist attraction centered on these horses.
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wish she would buy 5 square miles of land somewhere, fence it well. Make sure it has good water. And let a couple small bands loose already. Some of those older horses at fallon sure would like that much better than that other place they will send them soon.
That other place will be to crowded! 1,700 horses on 5,000? acres is so much more crowded than even the infamous meduna 350? on 3,000 acres! God I hate to see those horses after the first winter, living on barren sand/dirt and their hooves will be horrible 😦
and the land owner trying to feed /care for them on less than 1$ a day!
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Let me say..I am willing to let bygones be bygones..this is the polar opposite of statements made and documented by Mr. Kudnra of the Calico horses..He is a business man and real estate developer..if he can see money to be made he is willing to switch sides..I will accept that..after all we have been asking for private /public partnerships..I consider this to be the second alternative(BLM speak) to having that 20 million acres returned to the horses…that my point of view and I am sticking to it..
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Vanity fair article refrencing this.
http://www.vanityfair.com/online/daily/2010/06/a-solution-for-americas-wild-horse-crisis.html
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I would rather pay for horses to roam semi-free in natural family bands, in perpetuity, than continue to stockpile them in perpetuity. When do we find out what the BLM thinks of the plans presented? Or do they just keep this to themselves in perpetuity?
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I agree, BLM seems to forget who’s money this is, why do we get NO say in how it’s spent? This whole system is so bungled as to be laughable, except it involves horses who deserve something, if not their old homes, then a better place thean a dirty holding pen.
Maybe MP in Denver will reveal what is going on w/her proposal.
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Yes, I hope someone in Denver will ask about the plans and when they plan on releasing their decision on them. I really would like to save some of these majestic genetics from the Calico herds and not geld them away forever.
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I am pulling for self sustaining herds and minimal, “in the wild” management. Karen Sussman has given me a real insight into this. The money that is and has been squandered can really do some good in that direction. What I see as the big fight is that for the public lands. We are in there battling for their birthright. As far as I am concerned, our wild horses and burros have as much legal title to that land as do the deer, the antelope and the sage grouse–not to mention the Lahontan cutthroat trout.
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I know we aren’t a wealthy Advocacy. If we were then a lot of the issues we’re encountering would be non-existent. But it’s a little frustrating sometimes to see how close we could be to providing homes, IN PERPUITY, for Nevada Wild Ones & Captives, when I see properties like these listed here – the size, scope & environments Wild Ones could survive on – and we’re unable to offer them that stability or a return to freedom simply because the majority of us are bereft of a few (hundred thousand) bucks.
http://www.landsofnevada.com/nevada/?detail=&inv_id=339812
http://www.landsofnevada.com/nevada/?detail=&inv_id=679877
http://www.landsofnevada.com/nevada/?detail=&inv_id=339970
http://www.landsofnevada.com/nevada/?detail=&inv_id=339824
Makes ya daydream a little, don’t it?
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um, that was IN PERPETUITY. Hard to make a reasonable point when Spell Check won’t help…
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Did anyone look up the Environmental Assessments on these? I looked up Battle Mountain in general and found these excerpts (read the entire doc):
“The most recent aerial census was conducted in March 2005. The current 2007 population based on an average annual increase of 12% is 336 wild horses within the HMA…
Wild horse locations as observed during census and distribution flights since 1974 indicate large fluctuations of wild horse distribution across the HMA, which is likely a result of snow depth and other seasonal factors, water and forage availability, harassment of wild horses, and over all population size and density…
Since 1998, the population of the South Shoshone HMA has decreased according to census data.The South Shoshone HMA population has never been reduced through a BLM wild horse gather.The cause of this decline is unknown. In fact, the wild horses in South Shoshone appeared to be very healthy during the last census flight in March, 2005, which is typically the leanest time of the year between winter and spring. Snowfall events or drought years may have increased…
…mortality rates within the herd. Mountain lion predation and illegal shootings may have also influenced the population…
Water sources are not as plentiful in the southern portion of the HMA where the majority of the wild horse concentration occurs…”
Did I read that correclty? There is, according to BLM mountian lion predation! The HMA, according to BLM, in this area has DECREASED since 1998 without BLM intervention! The average annual population increase according to BLM is 12%, not 20%! The horses are in the area with the least water, BLM, do you mean to tell me they are NOT devasting all the riparian ways in the area? There are large distribution of wild horse fluctuations across the HMA, BLM, you mean to tell me they don’t stay in one place and ruin the land? BLM do yo mean to tell me that horses do regulate their own herd sizes based on population size and density?
Liars, liars pants on fire!
Anyway, I also searched EPA for Toxic dumps. Found nothing. So did a more general search and found this headline, but oddly NO STORY. Maybe its been cleaned up, but wouldn’t that also be on the EPA site? Answer – yes it would. Hum, some more of that doctored stuff from EPA? But they missed deleting this headline, or maybe I missed the report from EPA (definatly possible):
“Nevada\’s toxic legacy: forgotten pesticide dump | rgj.com | The Reno Gazette-Journal … In this farming community about 50 miles south of Battle Mountain, rusted…”
http://www.rgj.com/article/99999999/NEWS/90819037/Nevada-s-toxic-legacy-forgotten-pesticide-dump
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the second property down offers owner financing for $25,000 down, is a fundraiser to raise this a possiblity? 640 acres is a start
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If we could fund raise, and I’m just playing ‘let’s pretend’ here for a moment, the Lovelock (Pershing County) area has a block of properties called the Majuba Hills; they run contiguous to each other. The blocks total 3070 acres, and the total price, without tax, license and air conditioning, is $445,000. It includes water rights and mineral rights, which means no funky Mining Company could proclaim ‘imminent domain’ and force the courts to allow them to run their BS on our ‘sanctuary’.
Half a million dollars for the possibility of a long, free & happy life for a group of Captives – that there, Dear Jan, is a fantasy worth indulging in.
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I am dreaming of that as we speak – I will be the lottery sinner in another 1/2 hour if all goes according to my plan!
Heads up though, if I understood some talk here a while back, if that land includes any cattle allotments then BLM can come and take your horses even if you object and refuse to put cattle on there. Probably could not apply once you have title? Probably not. Bet they would attempt to swoop them up befor that. I may have misunderstood this.
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I meant Winner of course (but that could lead to some sinning too)!
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Lisa, that’s $90 k as a down payment, how do we get that kind of money? though it’s been done, however, 3000 acres is only supportive of about 15 horses, is it worth it? How do we start accessing people who HAVE that kind of disposable money?
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I would have to defer to experts on the size of the new herds, but the point of THIS excercise is to provide a fantasy ‘free-range’ for as many ‘unadoptables’ as possible. There are many large pieces of land around Northern Nevada, some right next to each other, that are being sold for a relative pittance. More than half the Bureau’s sniveling is about the cost of care & feeding of Captives. This would remove that burden from the BLM & provide on-the-range Forever Homes for older Wild Ones who may never have the chance to live a life of normalcy otherwise.
I would hope there might be some Advocates of the celebrity/financier variety who would consider it. I know it couldn’t possibly be as simple as buy the land, adopt the Horses and we all live happily ever after. But, Hell, it’s a start. Maybe we could start a resource pool or trust, strictly for land purchases & maintenance costs.
I gotta $125 in quarters just BURNIN’ a hole in my pocket…
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Lisa, I don’t see why this is not doable. Just have to get the right people with a few deep pockets to put a foundation together. Michelle Obama, (I missed most of the report) is promoting getting kids outdoors to places just like we and Madeliene Pickens are talking about (maybe she HAS been listening to us? Who knows? If not, nice fantasy anyway).
What chaps me though is we already own over 20 million acres that was designated for the horses primary use – Public Land.
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Finally got the audio working so I could listen to the video. We are all so wanting to get those horses out of the hell that they have been put in that this looks good at first sight—BUT—that isn’t very much land for them, and as Mar said, it is also used for cattle allotments. What protection would they have? That land could be sold right out from under them, couldn’t it? There is an old piece of wisdom that my Grandmother taught me–turn off the sound and watch them–you’re not so apt to be distracted by words. Wow, just thought of something–maybe it was no accident that the audio didn’t work at first. Gave me a chance to do just that.
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live streaming video of the Denver meetings! tune in..monday and tuesday-info
http://wildhorsewarriors.blogspot.com/
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Call me obstinite(and there are those that do) why are we even considering this..we pay taxes to support those wild horses on the land..we are paying more taxes to have them rounded up and removed from the land…and then taxes for third time to have them in long term holding or sanctuarys??? We have to put our foot down and say we are going to take our stand..right here right now..I am NOT going to pay more taxes just so more cattle ranches can be subsidised at my expense, or to make it more fast tractable for energy…government needs to make it work..we(the horses) are the only ones being asked to compramise..since when is that a compramise? Who is giving on the other side of the table..The horses need to be “made whole’ in legal terms
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Sandra, you go girl! Again! You are so right and you always wrap up everything so succinctly and pull us back into focus.
I believe there are advocacy groups against government waste and corruption. I will start searching and then research them. Some may be the opposite of what their name implies (Sue Wallis group as example). Maybe we need to split some time away from this core work, assign people to different tasks in little work groups and hammer away with those folks against welfare ranching. I know I have become passionate about that – kick the bums off horse land! Heck, kick all the welfare bums off all public lands!
Good project for some folks in Herd Watch. I mean, I’ve decided to do that anyway, why not see if others want to also.
Sorry to all good family folks, but we have an excess of beef production here and I can’t chose you over the wild ones. Most beef (97%) does not have the luxury of tax funded lively hoods. If I had my way, I would have Salazar GIVE you the land he intends for Salazoo, pay Cattoor to move your cattle, heck, even tax funded houses, barns, fencing, etc, equivalent to what you already have to prohibit cattle on Public Lands.
Then we can start getting the horses in holding returned. And start or find an existing coalition to work WITH energy for coexistence with wild horses.
Just a tad off topic – we are not going to get rid of energy needs unless we all have huge solar panels on our roofs and drive at least 80% of our driving time in electric cars with more environmentally friendly batteries. Which by the way, Germany and Switzerland I think – someone is forging head long into that technology. Also, put one of those little gas makers in our back yards – they are cool – about $10 to $15,000, make 20 to 30 gallons a day out of sugar, which we can make here out of by products,or grow for that purpose and is, like bamboo, self perepetuating (I’ve been told), and they are safe, not like a still with fire hazards. Then there is the air car! CNG is here to stay, but, in Europe they get it locally from dumps instead of piping across everywhere. In Europe there are no Public Lands and can’t just pipe through people’s property, so they think out of different boxes than we do. And they have trains, less semi hauling products, and cities are not as urbanized so walking and biking are more practical, not spread out all over the place like here, etc, etc. UK is even reintroducing wild horses to help with their ecosystems, and they ARE non-native exotic there!
I think we need to go back to the Old World for some New Ideas. What have we been doing lately? The USA, supposedly, according to ourselves anyway, the most highly advanced industrious nation in the world is being left behind in the dust on almost every front.
Last rant – so zebras are non-native exotic creatures to Africa!?!?!?! Can you imagine Africa without Zebras? Zebra gathers?
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I agree with Sandra! ENOUGH is ENOUGH!! We the PUBLIC, need a hand in these decisions the BLM is making, single handedly, (….or under the table) What the BLM is doing does NOT make any FISCAL sense, at all and it is in violation of the 1971 Free Horse and Burro Act, on multiple grounds. The Lawsuit need to be refilled immediately, and first and foremost an order for MORATORIUM on roundups, obtained, until the Legal situation is resolved! The FREE FOR ALL, for privat Livestock companies MUST END!! I too refuse to pay taxes and subsidize them on our PUBLIC LANDS!!
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One thing we need to keep in mind is changing the legislation is paramount.
Because, the 1971 Act has been so revised through legislation many times. So it may it appears that BLm breaking some law, they are not. IDA and some other legal eagles have pointed this out to us.
I’m kind of torn whether law suites are having any real impact on big picture issues, especially considering the cost and time, which most of us don’t even know about. Could that be better spent somewhere else? There have been some little victories here and there, but very easily wiped out by an appeal or another suit from deep pockets.
On the other hand, everytime we lose we learn new strategies and get a news article or two – any news article is good news. As long as Spriggs and his firm are willing to go on, who knows what will come? They could save the day in some way.
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I agree with Sandra. Right now, anything looks better than that hellish feedlot–BUT
They need to be taken BACK TO THEIR HOME–the Calico range. They are all packed and ready–no need to move them twice –now is the time to do it. Enough time and money has been wasted already.
WHY has Madeleine Picken’s offer not been accepted? She has found some wonderful ground.
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Sure if we could get them returned soon enough. Do we think we can make that happen?
I don’t see how supporting these immediate offers pulls any other strategies off the table. Why would we stop the fight on the fonrt lines just because we have won a few battles for a few horses along the way? I just don’t see anyone on the side of at least considering these proposals saying that.
A few horses, whose fate is immedialty dubious, I would add.
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